Curse

generik · Nov 05, 2006, 10:25 PM // 22:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Str0b0

What tickles me about these types of people is that 90% of the time if you put them in the Elite mission they would immediately become a liability to any group they are in because they simply aren't good enough to be in an elite area. Of course that doesn't stop them from wanting to be in the Elite areas though. I remember that during the elite mission weekend, The Deep was flooded with newbs and most of them had no idea what the mission entailed. They couldn't communicate, they couldn't work as a team and most players just got fed up with them and the entire Elite weekend. There were so many Leroy's down there it was ridiculous, and a lot of whiners complaining that they couldn't get into groups because they lacked the proper build. Those elite areas are difficult to do and require a well planned out team with certain builds that have well defined jobs to do. There isn't a lot of room for experimentation. I've seen even proper groups fail The Deep and the Warren through no fault of their own, they just got beat by the mission. So what makes every Tom Dick and Harry think that they can compete in these high end areas?

Has it occurred to you that these people are newbs because it is their first time there?

It is like evolution man, restricting access = less players = slower rate of evolution of game play strategies. Do you think we would have barrage/pet if access to old tombs were restricted to a grand total of 1 out of every 1000? Don't think so.

Make access to the elite missions restricted to certain times of the day or even the weekends only if that's what it takes. 100% total lockout is uncalled for plain and simple. If you fail to see that you are just an elitist twat and nothing more.

generik · Nov 05, 2006, 10:31 PM // 22:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bankai

That argument is bullcrap.

If you have bought a game, I immediately want to be lvl 20 with all skills unlocked, all green items in the game, and fow armor. I mean, I paid for it.

YOUR argument is bullcrap.

Guess what? Skills, items, fow armor. All these can be earned by YOUR own individual merit.

What about access to elite missions? Hmm let's see. Well you can singlehandled buy 100 copies of factions. Download Autohotkey and make bots to farm faction out of Fort Aspenwood by leeching. Even then I still don't see you entering the elite areas any time soon.

Oh, now you change your tact and say well access to elite missions are granted to those who can work in the "team" (ie: alliance) and contribute towards that goal. Quite a leap to go from what is attainable as an individual to a guild.. nah.. 10 guilds don't ya think? Access to the elite missions is by Anet's definition, exclusive. Because only the top 1000 players can attain it any one time. Not a region, not 50%, heck, not even 10%. An alliance is limited to at most a certain number of players, and these players and these only can gain access at any one time.

So Anet wants us to spend time "fighting" with each other. Way to go Anet. In fact this is a better time and gold sink than just charging each of us 10K to enter each time... you know, rather than creating some REAL content. Guess the average joe player is smart enough to see through it, and the same elitist twerps are too dumb to realise it.

What's next?

"Earn your free KILLER ARMOR skins by exchanging the head of a known Blizzard employee for an access key by mailing said head to NCSoft at the following address..."

Because by your analogy it is fair dinkum for Anet to make you do anything they want for access to what you paid for.

Zinger314 · Nov 05, 2006, 10:34 PM // 22:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by generik

What about access to elite missions? Hmm let's see. Well you can singlehandled buy 100 copies of factions. Download Autohotkey and make bots to farm faction out of Fort Aspenwood by leeching. Even then I still don't see you entering the elite areas any time soon.

I think you killed your own argument there.

Angelica · Nov 05, 2006, 10:36 PM // 22:36

Take it easy people this is still a game!

I have only been to Urgoz once and it was not so interesting, long, boring and the items .... well I did not get any!

I never been in all the other places, first because no one will take me :P second, I really don't care! If people in my guild or pugs feel like I'm not good enough to go with them.

I play mostly only PvE and now with the improved henchies I don't have to beg/ask for help ....... unless the mission is very hard!

Really who wants to play a game that stresses you and make you swear?

Not me thx. Real life to do that every day, games should relieve you of your stress and make it easier, at least for a while you can escape reality!

Bloodied Blade · Nov 05, 2006, 10:44 PM // 22:44

...here's a novel idea-

1.) ping the favored skillbar if that's what you need for a ferry. Amazingly you can change your skills. If teams won't let you in, tough...we all have to deal with that.

2.) if you don't want to take the time to earn favor and can't be bothered with it, change to a European server.

...problem solved.

Engel the Fallen · Nov 05, 2006, 11:06 PM // 23:06

Well before Nightfall was released I got bored and grabbed and preordered FF XII. Man this game sucks though. I mean, to access the highest level of dungeons you need to actually play through the game. I mean how stupid is that? It should totally be based off some a side game that has nothing to do with the game alot of people play. I mean, god how boring is it if your own actions control what you can access, rather than have a group who either cannot access or do not want to access the area control it.

And moreso, I was able to really rush right into the high end areas. Man, talk about fun killer. I was expecting to farm at least 18 hours a day for 2 weeks, then 8 hours a day there on just to be able to play these special areas. God, this game is horrid.

I am so glad I have Guild Wars though to keep the tried and true custom of how games should be played alive. I love swapping regions to be able to access elite missions, and having to keep a list of people who I do not like, but speak to to help me get into elite missions. And of course, having one character who's sole function is to park in the factions elite missions. I guess that was what the prerelease character slot was for though. To make up for the one you will never get to play again.

Matix411 · Nov 05, 2006, 11:08 PM // 23:08

Wow, who cares.
Honestly.
Does it really affect you THAT much if you don't have 'free', sorry, 'quick' access to areas like The Deep, FoW, or UW?
I highly doubt that.
These areas have restrictions upon accessing them because they are deemed 'special' or 'elite', that is why you pay 1k to get into FoW and require a skilled team to successfully move about the area. That is why The Deep requires some level of merit to enter.
If everybody could enter these areas at will, it would be ridiculous.
JUST like the 'everybody gets access to Elite missions' weekend.
People with level 12's being ferried to The Deep? Hello?
Not to mention that all the rare and special items you can recieve in these areas would plummit in price. Zodiac weapons? Ectos? There would be no satisfaction in having one because EVERYBODY ELSE would have them.

Like people have said numerous times;
You did not pay to have access to all content possible;
"You paid for the game as it was designed by the people who created it."
Which is true, absolutely.

Personally I don't care whether I ever get to The Deep.
1k to enter FoW and UW is kind of a waste considering we already have to wait for favor, which I agree we shouldn't have to do, and should either do one or the other; IE. Pay or wait.
But regardless, it's not like I'm spending the majority of my time farming those areas, so I don't need to waste the money and the time to get in.

Unless these areas are going to have some severe impact on your characters/general gameplay, there is no reason why we should have easy/free/quick access to any of them.
Just like FoW armor is so expensive.
There is no personal benefit besides the reward of having it. And if the armor were easy to get, there would be no reward. As much as everybody pretty much has the set now, that's still not the point.
People work for that which they truly desire. As much as it sucks, and the waiting is lame, and you want these things NOW, that's not always how things work, and that's certainly not how ANet developed Guild Wars.

/vomit

korcan · Nov 05, 2006, 11:11 PM // 23:11

the whole point of faction farming and controlling towns are for the perks associated with it. if an alliance has control over a town and decides that theyre going to charge people outside of their alliance access to their elite or shut people out entirely, they are entitled to that decision. the alliance that controls a town had to "grind" [unless people actually enjoy faction farming] for it and will have to continue to "grind" to maintain it so what they choose to do with that control is completely up to them.

there is more content to the game then just the elite missions. and im sure that once youve done the elites a few times youll understand why the majority of people could care less about them.

generik · Nov 05, 2006, 11:25 PM // 23:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Engel the Fallen

Well before Nightfall was released I got bored and grabbed and preordered FF XII. Man this game sucks though. I mean, to access the highest level of dungeons you need to actually play through the game. I mean how stupid is that? It should totally be based off some a side game that has nothing to do with the game alot of people play. I mean, god how boring is it if your own actions control what you can access, rather than have a group who either cannot access or do not want to access the area control it.

And moreso, I was able to really rush right into the high end areas. Man, talk about fun killer. I was expecting to farm at least 18 hours a day for 2 weeks, then 8 hours a day there on just to be able to play these special areas. God, this game is horrid.

I am so glad I have Guild Wars though to keep the tried and true custom of how games should be played alive. I love swapping regions to be able to access elite missions, and having to keep a list of people who I do not like, but speak to to help me get into elite missions. And of course, having one character who's sole function is to park in the factions elite missions. I guess that was what the prerelease character slot was for though. To make up for the one you will never get to play again.

That is trolling. Playing through the entire game.. is NOTHING compared to what you would have to do to gain access to the elite missions.

Omega X · Nov 05, 2006, 11:40 PM // 23:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by korcan

the whole point of faction farming and controlling towns are for the perks associated with it. if an alliance has control over a town and decides that theyre going to charge people outside of their alliance access to their elite or shut people out entirely, they are entitled to that decision. the alliance that controls a town had to "grind" [unless people actually enjoy faction farming] for it and will have to continue to "grind" to maintain it so what they choose to do with that control is completely up to them.

there is more content to the game then just the elite missions. and im sure that once youve done the elites a few times youll understand why the majority of people could care less about them.

Having to get some burned out Alliance to grant you access to Elite areas was broken from day one. The Majority would rather go to UW/FoW when the favor is up, even if having to wait for some random PvP group to win.

I wonder what PvPers would say if PvEers had control over PvP arenas. Or could control that gate that let them GvG. Now that would be funny.

generik · Nov 06, 2006, 12:20 AM // 00:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zinger314

I think you killed your own argument there.

In what way?

Tell me, how can YOU gain faction to get into the elite mission? I do not mean YOU as in "you" alone, by "you" I am referring to EVERYBODY.

Unlike TOA where a reasonable proportion of the player's base is eligible to enter UW/FoW at any time with the payment of an entrance fee, this is not the case here for Urgoz and the Deep. Today you are in an alliance which charges 5K daily. Tomorrow EVERYBODY is doing as you said and working hard to earn their access. A month from now you will need 50K daily to maintain your access. Same other players will still be working still even harder to compete. Soon it will rise to 100K daily, 1 million daily... when will it ever end?

That's right. You bot. There is no other way. It is a flawed system intrinsically, because at the very end of the extreme it breaks down like this, and even then not everyone will still gain access.

Str0b0 · Nov 06, 2006, 01:13 AM // 01:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by generik

Has it occurred to you that these people are newbs because it is their first time there?

It is like evolution man, restricting access = less players = slower rate of evolution of game play strategies. Do you think we would have barrage/pet if access to old tombs were restricted to a grand total of 1 out of every 1000? Don't think so.

Make access to the elite missions restricted to certain times of the day or even the weekends only if that's what it takes. 100% total lockout is uncalled for plain and simple. If you fail to see that you are just an elitist twat and nothing more.

There has never been a 100% lockout ever and no one is asking for that. I always love this style of argument though," You either see it my way or you're (insert choice insult here)." I don't see anyone in the stores saying," You know what, since I can't access the Elite missions screw this game." It's not going to happen. Innovation happens regardless of population size.

B/P is a really bad example to use. If you look at the first mention of it I'll bet you find that it was created by a seasoned farmer or team of farmers and not some goober that fell off the internet turnip truck. I hate it for you man but historically speaking ground breaking builds are created by seasoned players and seasoning has nothing to do with the ability to access Elite content. Seasoning happens by regular gameplay, which last time I checked, wasn't restricted.

First timers in Elite sections can still be competent players through regular gameplay experience. That's how I got my first introduction to Elite content, not through some cheap access gimmick. I got my first invite to the Deep by performing well in an Alliance battle. We lost the battle but I did my job well and that performance was recognized by the Alliance holding Cavalon at the time. It was my first time there but after a quick strategy briefing I knew my job and performed well. Not every player in this game has that kind of seasoning and giving them unrestricted access to the Elite content will make them too frustrating to play. If you have the skill then you can get yourself noticed. It can be done. What I'm hearing thought is,"Oh but Str0b0 I'm too lazy to get there on my own merits. I want to whine to the devs until I get a free ride." Tough cookies! It's a mechanic of the game and a well founded one if you ask me. Cry about it all you like but I say it should stay the way it is for good reasons.

Gli · Nov 06, 2006, 02:00 AM // 02:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Str0b0

There has never been a 100% lockout ever and no one is asking for that.

No, it's in reality just a 99.95 lockout, thanks for setting things straight.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Str0b0

I got my first invite to the Deep by performing well in an Alliance battle. We lost the battle but I did my job well and that performance was recognized by the Alliance holding Cavalon at the time. It was my first time there but after a quick strategy briefing I knew my job and performed well. Not every player in this game has that kind of seasoning and giving them unrestricted access to the Elite content will make them too frustrating to play. If you have the skill then you can get yourself noticed.

You're not reallly serious there, right? "On your own merit" indeed.

You didn't get there "on your own merit". You got there by sheer luck and happenstance. What if no one who could have granted you access had been paying attention during that legendary game of quick wits and unsurpassed skills? What if you'd been doing a good job in the company of the 99.95% of the player base NOT holding Cavalon? What if you only EVER play with people not being able to grant you access, because you only play with a select group of people? Where would your skills get you then? The only skill you'd need in that case is the skill to beg for rides.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Str0b0

What I'm hearing thought is,"Oh but Str0b0 I'm too lazy to get there on my own merits. I want to whine to the devs until I get a free ride."

Again, no one is asking for a free ride. All we need is for people to be able to earn access "on their own merit", instead of either being forced to play with hundreds of people of whom I don't even care if they lived or died, or to beg those same people.

Knightsaber Sith · Nov 06, 2006, 02:24 AM // 02:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaile Gray

Some Guild Wars updates are of things you can predict, such as the ability to attain higher ranks and get elite mission access, both of which were, I believe, foreshadowed in The Manuscripts for Nightfall. What cooler way to build long-distance goals than to see the addition of new options and new tests and trials for your characters?

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...88&postcount=1

So..... I guess alternate elite mission access is coming.

A Perfect Slayer · Nov 06, 2006, 02:27 AM // 02:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bankai

That argument is bullcrap.

If you have bought a game, I immediately want to be lvl 20 with all skills unlocked, all green items in the game, and fow armor. I mean, I paid for it.

I totally disagree with this. I would not buy a game if they gave you acess to everything from the start because the game would not be fun this way. Play the game! discover things, become a good player, experiment!

Alt F Four · Nov 06, 2006, 03:11 AM // 03:11

And now, Alt F Four will get the thread locked by stating the blindingly obvious:

Sorry buddy, but guess what? You already bought Nightfall, and Anet already has their money. Infact, they had their money when they sold it to the store you bought it from.

Better yet, if you bought it online. 50 bucks for a... what was it, seven digit number? Please show me where in the EULA it states that Anet has to give you access to every last shred of un-earned content in the game?

I'm tired of people whining like children about not having favor. You know what these people do about it? They sit on their hands and wait for a PvP team to get favor.

I'm not sorry in the least that you can't touch things because America dosen't have favor. Suck it up, it's just a video game.

Mr_T_bot · Nov 06, 2006, 03:16 AM // 03:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by IIIPowerIII

You dont have Favor, make a group and go get them.

Then you get stuck in the hall, if you leave or fail to a group of a different country, you lose favor. You never get to play the area. Stupid suggestion.

Quote:

You want to go in Urgoz, then go earn Faction and control a town...

Control a town? You mean control the one town that has access to the mission. Let's not forget that controlling far more irrelevant towns requires millions of Faction transferred. A full guild of straight faction farmers would take probably a month to control the town. Stupid suggestion.

Quote:

They want everything for free, and now want unlimited access to elite mission anytime?

God forbid we are granted access to content we already paid for and that is the only real end game content for those games. And the ones in Factions will completely die as everyone leaves the game.

Quote:

Now we will see soon, people asking to get some perfect req8 crystalinne sword because they paid for the game...

Not only full of stupid suggestions, but also logical fallacies.

Gli · Nov 06, 2006, 03:26 AM // 03:26

I'm petitioning to have a GWG forum-specific version of Godwin's Law, pertaining to "free FoW" armor and "perfect crystaline swords" instead of Nazis and Hitler.

generik · Nov 06, 2006, 03:36 AM // 03:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by A Perfect Slayer

I totally disagree with this. I would not buy a game if they gave you acess to everything from the start because the game would not be fun this way. Play the game! discover things, become a good player, experiment!

We are not asking for a completely free ride here.

FoW armor is not even a valid comparison, how much is that? 100+ ectos and shards plus 75K, pfft! Cheap!

To gain access to Cavalon/HzH requires an UNBOUNDED amount of time and money. That's right, it is a virtually unbounded requirement that depends on how tough the competition is. How is that fair to expect everyone who just wants to gain access to do just that.

You may be some cheap punk living out of your parents' basement, but the rest of us has other responsibilities and yes, real lifes. When factions was released Anet said they'd implement some form of alternate access. Now Nightfall is out and there is still nothing. What the hell is going on here.

Again, nobody is asking for a free ride. Make a NPC charge 10K per entry, so be it. Piss off on that stupid elitist attitude, I'd gladly pay 10K each time to a NPC than to even pay 1K to get a "ferry" from the likes of you.

generik · Nov 06, 2006, 03:38 AM // 03:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alt F Four

And now, Alt F Four will get the thread locked by stating the blindingly obvious:

Sorry buddy, but guess what? You already bought Nightfall, and Anet already has their money. Infact, they had their money when they sold it to the store you bought it from.

Better yet, if you bought it online. 50 bucks for a... what was it, seven digit number? Please show me where in the EULA it states that Anet has to give you access to every last shred of un-earned content in the game?

I'm tired of people whining like children about not having favor. You know what these people do about it? They sit on their hands and wait for a PvP team to get favor.

I'm not sorry in the least that you can't touch things because America dosen't have favor. Suck it up, it's just a video game.

Considering said Alt F Four is probably spending his Fridays and weekends winning favor for said losers then taunting emotes like his life depended on it, perhaps you should be the one who should realise it is "just a video game".